Go Back   Virtual Sheet Music Forums > Classical Music Discussions > More About Classical Music...
User Name or E-Mail Address
Password


Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
  #1  
Old 03-19-2006, 07:53 PM
Rebecca+Brown's Avatar
Rebecca+Brown Rebecca+Brown is offline
Junior Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Desert southwest
Posts: 23
Smile Help! Transposing is killing me

Hi! I am trying to arrange a piece for flute, piano and horn in F.
(the piece is Evergreen, I know its not classical, but maybe someone can help)

I have the music arranged exactly the way I want it...but neither I, nor my music mentor can agree on which key they all need to be in.

I have horn with 4 sharps, and flute and Piano in C major....

Can anyone suggest which key each instrument needs to be in? I only have a single horn, and it won't go up above F. (the F at the top of the staff). I can get to F#. My horn also won't go below the low F. So I have 2 octaves to play with.

Can anyone help me??
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 03-20-2006, 02:32 AM
suetuba suetuba is offline
Expert Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 88
Default

I don't know the range of the piece, but a useful way of working this out is to remember that C on the horn is concert pitch F, ( on the piano); a horn part should always be in one more sharp than the piano part.
So if you want the piano part to be in C, then the horn part will be in G. If you want the horn in E, then the piano part is in A.
I always make a transposition chart when doing this kind of stuff: write a chromatic scale out over one octave for the piano, then underneath, aligning the notes accurately, write the matching chromatic scale for whatever instrument you are transposing to/from. I.e. for horn, write a C chromatic scale starting at F on the piano chromatic scale. This will tell you which note corresponds with which; especially useful with accidentals!
Hope this helps
Sue
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 03-20-2006, 02:44 AM
Rebecca+Brown's Avatar
Rebecca+Brown Rebecca+Brown is offline
Junior Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Desert southwest
Posts: 23
Default

Thank you very much for the information on this. I got the music from a midi, then converted it with Finale, and arranged the parts to my liking. Only thing I could not do was the correct key signature. I will try your advice. Thank you again!
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 03-20-2006, 04:19 AM
suetuba suetuba is offline
Expert Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 88
Default

highly impressed with your computer knowledge! Anyone who can work out that lot will find transposition a doddle, once you get used to it!
I never managed to work any of those notation programmes, I must admit. It's quicker for me to grab pen and manuscript...
Sue
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 03-20-2006, 05:05 AM
Francesca Lee's Avatar
Francesca Lee Francesca Lee is offline
Mentor Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Location?? What do you mean??? Uh oh...I'M LOST AGAIN!!!!
Posts: 1,135
Send a message via AIM to Francesca Lee Send a message via MSN to Francesca Lee Send a message via Yahoo to Francesca Lee
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by reebs

I have horn with 4 sharps, and flute and Piano in C major....


Ugh, I hate writing for horn...it's always so confusing and time consuming...but um, if the concert pitch instruments are in C, shouldn't the horn be in F? (One flat...) Wait...now I'm confused...your writing for French Horn, right???
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 03-20-2006, 05:31 AM
suetuba suetuba is offline
Expert Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 88
Default

You might be confusing the pitch of the instrument ( F in this case) with a key. No connection! (Otherwise horn players would only have to learn one scale!)

Because the horn is notated as a transposing instrument ( a relic from the days of crooks), it is referred to as being 'in' F. (nothing to do with any key, hang in with me here....)

Horn in F refers to the pitch of the harmonic series of the tubing, and by convention with horns the first, second and fourth harmonics are referred to as C by the horn player, when it is actually concert F. So if C on the horn is F on the piano, then a horn will always be notated in one sharp more than the piano.

Same notation convention applies for Bb trumpets, and their relatives in various pitches; the number of sharps different from concert pitch will vary according to the pitch of the trumpet.

DOESN'T apply for trombones (Bb and Eb) and tubas (Bb, C, Eb, F), we notate in concert pitch.

Sue

Last edited by suetuba : 03-22-2006 at 01:13 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 03-31-2006, 03:55 AM
Rebecca+Brown's Avatar
Rebecca+Brown Rebecca+Brown is offline
Junior Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Desert southwest
Posts: 23
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by suetuba
Horn in F refers to the pitch of the harmonic series of the tubing, and by convention with horns the first, second and fourth harmonics are referred to as C by the horn player, when it is actually concert F. So if C on the horn is F on the piano, then a horn will always be notated in one sharp more than the piano.


Sue

oh my....I am still all confused...is there a place I could post my arrangement where someone smarter than I could look, and tell me which keys I need to be in??? lolol
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 03-31-2006, 12:05 PM
YKB's Avatar
YKB YKB is offline
Mentor Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: At this point, Cyberspace
Posts: 1,186
Default

Sure, post it here and I'll take a look at it. Ihave some experiance transposing arranging etc.....

I'll take look at it and try to help!
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 03-31-2006, 01:58 PM
Rebecca+Brown's Avatar
Rebecca+Brown Rebecca+Brown is offline
Junior Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Desert southwest
Posts: 23
Default

Ok, thank you, I will... how do I do that? Cut and paste onto the board? It is in Finale format. (I've not posted sheet music before...blush)

Last edited by Rebecca+Brown : 03-31-2006 at 01:59 PM. Reason: trying to post attachment
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 04-01-2006, 12:35 AM
YKB's Avatar
YKB YKB is offline
Mentor Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: At this point, Cyberspace
Posts: 1,186
Default

Whrn you post, there is a button on the bottom called "Manage Attachments"

Click that and go from there....

Which Finale version is it in?
Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Transposing 3 sax_player Alto Saxophone 11 05-09-2011 04:10 PM
Transposing music sax_player Alto Saxophone 18 05-04-2011 03:42 PM


All times are GMT +1. The time now is 09:18 AM.